New fueling option for the Explorer - Port Injection

[WFO-TSi]

Without being on the High Performance Explorer ST Facebook group I'm guessing I am the last one to find out about the Port Injection Kit that EMS is offering.

EMS 3.0L Ford Explorer EcoBoost Port Injection Kit – Engineered Motorsport Solutions (emsinc-tn.com)

With it costing less than Nostrum's Stage 1 Bundle and flowing more than their Stage 3 Bundle...what's the downside?

The factory charge pipe has a lengthy silicone coupler connecting it to the throttle body, so I speculate you wouldn't even need a modified charge pipe despite the increased plenum height. It's probably also only a matter of time before our favorite tuners have mastered its integration.

Thoughts?

 

[mitchellj22]

I’m not an expert, or even knowledgeable about an upgrade like this, but am definitely interested. Would love some more of us who are more mechanically experienced to sound off. From what I do know is that the mod on its face seems like a no-brainer. It’s only slightly more expensive than the cost of getting the intake valves walnut blasted (I was quoted just over $1,100 by the only local shop I’m aware that is capable of this type of service). Instead of doing that I’d rather just add port injection, and if I can increase my fuel flow that way then that’s an added bonus. More fuel, more power, cleaner engine. I’m not seeing any downsides here. I can’t believe no one has responded to your post.

I however seem to be the ONLY person (correct me if I’m wrong, I’d prefer to not be the only person) who is interested in doing something like this but only strictly running premium gasoline. Chemistry is not for me and I’m not going to f*** around with mixing ethanol. I’d rather keep it simple and just pump premium fuel in my ride. I don’t see why we can’t still get a tune that increases power with the HPFP without running weird ethanol concoctions. Like if I’m adding a larger intake and larger exhaust I need to add more fuel right??

Why are HPFP ONLY recommended around here if we’re running e50 or whatever it’s called. Why are they only needed for these crazy fuel blends. Would they not also be needed for 93 or 91 tuned vehicles with other upgrades in order to achieve more power than the basic tune?

I’d really like to know. But at minimum if our OEM fuel pumps ARE able to handle premium fuel on a performance tune by say Goose or ZFG, and they can’t increase power with HPFP for whatever reason for those of us who aren’t mixing fuel, AT LEAST I’ll have piece of mind with the fuel delivery and not have to pay thousands periodically to have my intake valves walnut blasted (which is practically required for high performance DI engines).

 

[UNBROKEN]

I’m not an expert, or even knowledgeable about an upgrade like this, but am definitely interested. Would love some more of us who are more mechanically experienced to sound off. From what I do know is that the mod on its face seems like a no-brainer. It’s only slightly more expensive than the cost of getting the intake valves walnut blasted (I was quoted just over $1,100 by the only local shop I’m aware that is capable of this type of service). Instead of doing that I’d rather just add port injection, and if I can increase my fuel flow that way then that’s an added bonus. More fuel, more power, cleaner engine. I’m not seeing any downsides here. I can’t believe no one has responded to your post.

I however seem to be the ONLY person (correct me if I’m wrong, I’d prefer to not be the only person) who is interested in doing something like this but only strictly running premium gasoline. Chemistry is not for me and I’m not going to f*** around with mixing ethanol. I’d rather keep it simple and just pump premium fuel in my ride. I don’t see why we can’t still get a tune that increases power with the HPFP without running weird ethanol concoctions. Like if I’m adding a larger intake and larger exhaust I need to add more fuel right??

Why are HPFP ONLY recommended around here if we’re running e50 or whatever it’s called. Why are they only needed for these crazy fuel blends. Would they not also be needed for 93 or 91 tuned vehicles with other upgrades in order to achieve more power than the basic tune?

I’d really like to know. But at minimum if our OEM fuel pumps ARE able to handle premium fuel on a performance tune by say Goose or ZFG, and they can’t increase power with HPFP for whatever reason for those of us who aren’t mixing fuel, AT LEAST I’ll have piece of mind with the fuel delivery and not have to pay thousands periodically to have my intake valves walnut blasted (which is practically required for high performance DI engines).

You have some misunderstandings on the subject. You don’t need to add fuel with a simple CAI or exhaust swap and you don’t need to add anything for an E50 tune except ethanol. The bigger HPFP and injectors are for running E60- straight E85.

 

[2020FordRaptor]

I’m not an expert, or even knowledgeable about an upgrade like this, but am definitely interested. Would love some more of us who are more mechanically experienced to sound off. From what I do know is that the mod on its face seems like a no-brainer. It’s only slightly more expensive than the cost of getting the intake valves walnut blasted (I was quoted just over $1,100 by the only local shop I’m aware that is capable of this type of service). Instead of doing that I’d rather just add port injection, and if I can increase my fuel flow that way then that’s an added bonus. More fuel, more power, cleaner engine. I’m not seeing any downsides here. I can’t believe no one has responded to your post.

I however seem to be the ONLY person (correct me if I’m wrong, I’d prefer to not be the only person) who is interested in doing something like this but only strictly running premium gasoline. Chemistry is not for me and I’m not going to f*** around with mixing ethanol. I’d rather keep it simple and just pump premium fuel in my ride. I don’t see why we can’t still get a tune that increases power with the HPFP without running weird ethanol concoctions. Like if I’m adding a larger intake and larger exhaust I need to add more fuel right??

Why are HPFP ONLY recommended around here if we’re running e50 or whatever it’s called. Why are they only needed for these crazy fuel blends. Would they not also be needed for 93 or 91 tuned vehicles with other upgrades in order to achieve more power than the basic tune?

I’d really like to know. But at minimum if our OEM fuel pumps ARE able to handle premium fuel on a performance tune by say Goose or ZFG, and they can’t increase power with HPFP for whatever reason for those of us who aren’t mixing fuel, AT LEAST I’ll have piece of mind with the fuel delivery and not have to pay thousands periodically to have my intake valves walnut blasted (which is practically required for high performance DI engines).

You misunderstand quite a bit of this. Any tuner will tune for whatever mods you have for pump gas, no tuner every said otherwise. You do not need more fueling for a simple intake and exhaust (which don’t help power anyway), the stock fuel system does just fine, and you are limited by your fuel, not the fuel system. The OEM pump and injectors handle premium fuel without breaking a sweat, don’t know where you heard otherwise.

As far as carbon buildup, that only becomes a problem after a LOT of miles, and even then you had to have been using crappy fuel constantly for that to become a problem. With a catch can, Top Tier Fuel, and proper maintenance, carbon buildup isn’t a problem.

 

[wifeys-ST]

I’m not an expert, or even knowledgeable about an upgrade like this, but am definitely interested. Would love some more of us who are more mechanically experienced to sound off. From what I do know is that the mod on its face seems like a no-brainer. It’s only slightly more expensive than the cost of getting the intake valves walnut blasted (I was quoted just over $1,100 by the only local shop I’m aware that is capable of this type of service). Instead of doing that I’d rather just add port injection, and if I can increase my fuel flow that way then that’s an added bonus. More fuel, more power, cleaner engine. I’m not seeing any downsides here. I can’t believe no one has responded to your post.

I however seem to be the ONLY person (correct me if I’m wrong, I’d prefer to not be the only person) who is interested in doing something like this but only strictly running premium gasoline. Chemistry is not for me and I’m not going to f*** around with mixing ethanol. I’d rather keep it simple and just pump premium fuel in my ride. I don’t see why we can’t still get a tune that increases power with the HPFP without running weird ethanol concoctions. Like if I’m adding a larger intake and larger exhaust I need to add more fuel right??

Why are HPFP ONLY recommended around here if we’re running e50 or whatever it’s called. Why are they only needed for these crazy fuel blends. Would they not also be needed for 93 or 91 tuned vehicles with other upgrades in order to achieve more power than the basic tune?

I’d really like to know. But at minimum if our OEM fuel pumps ARE able to handle premium fuel on a performance tune by say Goose or ZFG, and they can’t increase power with HPFP for whatever reason for those of us who aren’t mixing fuel, AT LEAST I’ll have piece of mind with the fuel delivery and not have to pay thousands periodically to have my intake valves walnut blasted (which is practically required for high performance DI engines).

I don’t think the previous responses were helpful so I’ll try. For optimal power you need a specific ratio of air to fuel. With premium gas, you can achieve that ratio easily with the factory fuel system. Adding more premium fuel will not add power, it will just reduce efficiency by making the engine run rich. Basically fuel just dumping out the exhaust. Where the extra power comes from is by advancing timing more. If you try advancing timing too far with premium gas you will get knock and can cause damage. With ethanal you can push the timing much further safely without knock which is where the big gain in power comes from. The downside of ethanol is that you need more volume of ethanol to have the same energy as premium gas. Which is why the stock fuel system is limited to e50. Only after upgrading the fuel system can you run e85 to flow more fuel.

 

[mitchellj22]

I don’t think the previous responses were helpful so I’ll try. For optimal power you need a specific ratio of air to fuel. With premium gas, you can achieve that ratio easily with the factory fuel system. Adding more premium fuel will not add power, it will just reduce efficiency by making the engine run rich. Basically fuel just dumping out the exhaust. Where the extra power comes from is by advancing timing more. If you try advancing timing too far with premium gas you will get knock and can cause damage. With ethanal you can push the timing much further safely without knock which is where the big gain in power comes from. The downside of ethanol is that you need more volume of ethanol to have the same energy as premium gas. Which is why the stock fuel system is limited to e50. Only after upgrading the fuel system can you run e85 to flow more fuel.

Thank you, that was much more helpful. Based off that information however, I'd still like to know if at any point a higher fuel flow rate would still be beneficial on a 93 octane-fed vehicle. There are many high performance vehicles that run on premium pump gas and not some necessary ethanol concoction. If I put on every bolt-on mod available in the air department (such as bigger intake, intercooler, downpipes, exhaust, turbos) plus a tune, are higher pressure fuel pumps still not necessary? Because I always thought to produce more power, if you increase the air flow, you need to increase the fuel rate to keep ratios within a certain spec to maximize performance efficiency. What's the most power capable in this vehicle if I refuse to use any other fuel than premium gas? Please tell me now.

Is there any point that this port injection kit becomes beneficial? And could I at least use it to improve engine dynamics and reliability if I can't actually increase power with it? Still however, I feel like to create more power you need more fuel. So, I'm still kind of confused how it can't help performance-wise even if I just use premium fuel and not an ethanol concoction. Are the oem pumps really that capable?