Stock fuel system e85 tuning

[ZFGracing]

Alright guys Explorer ST, I get asked this a lot. “I want to run ethanol, but I do not want to mix fuels and I’m not sure I want to buy the Xreme DI pump yet, is that my only options?” I typically try to get people into either e50 or buying the HPFP because that is what it takes if you want to push the ST to the limit of the turbos. However, there is a 3rd option and that is e85 on the stock fuel system. I have been doing this with some people in the f150 as we developed the flex fuel tune (yes flex fuel can work, I’m getting ready to release that in the f150 market next month). You may be thinking how is the a possible? The pump isn’t big enough? You have told us this since day one. Well you are right the pump isn’t big enough to push the truck, but if you want to run e85 on the stock fuel system it can be done at lower boost level. That’s what we have done with Ray’s to test it out. Running slightly more than stock boost takes use to roughly 95% capacity of the stock fuel system and we were able to run a 4.01 0-60. That is better than most 93 tunes and Also, because we are not leaning on the turbos very hard, there is less heat build up which is going to result in better ¼ mile times the 93, especially in the heat.

I think this going to be a great option if you are someone who wants to try e85 but does not want to blend fuels but still wants to try e85 before investing the HPFP and injectors. I understand it is a lot of money to invest to run e85 to its full potential and I’m hoping that this and the e50 option will help people realize the power potential of ethanol fuels.

This is also a great option for someone who want a very conservative, very consistent tune that does not fade away as fast a 93-octane tune on the big end.

Ultimately if you want to push your ST you need to upgrade the fuel system, there is just no way around that, but I also understand that not everyone wants to push it and having more options helps everyone else!

To kind of put these in order from lowest power to most here is the break down

Stock
93 octane
E85 stock fuel system
E50 stock fuel system
E50 upgraded fuel system
E85 upgraded fuel system

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

 

[Nbk4t5e]

Alright guys Explorer ST, I get asked this a lot. “I want to run ethanol, but I do not want to mix fuels and I’m not sure I want to buy the Xreme DI pump yet, is that my only options?” I typically try to get people into either e50 or buying the HPFP because that is what it takes if you want to push the ST to the limit of the turbos. However, there is a 3rd option and that is e85 on the stock fuel system. I have been doing this with some people in the f150 as we developed the flex fuel tune (yes flex fuel can work, I’m getting ready to release that in the f150 market next month). You may be thinking how is the a possible? The pump isn’t big enough? You have told us this since day one. Well you are right the pump isn’t big enough to push the truck, but if you want to run e85 on the stock fuel system it can be done at lower boost level. That’s what we have done with Ray’s to test it out. Running slightly more than stock boost takes use to roughly 95% capacity of the stock fuel system and we were able to run a 4.01 0-60. That is better than most 93 tunes and Also, because we are not leaning on the turbos very hard, there is less heat build up which is going to result in better ¼ mile times the 93, especially in the heat.

I think this going to be a great option if you are someone who wants to try e85 but does not want to blend fuels but still wants to try e85 before investing the HPFP and injectors. I understand it is a lot of money to invest to run e85 to its full potential and I’m hoping that this and the e50 option will help people realize the power potential of ethanol fuels.

This is also a great option for someone who want a very conservative, very consistent tune that does not fade away as fast a 93-octane tune on the big end.

Ultimately if you want to push your ST you need to upgrade the fuel system, there is just no way around that, but I also understand that not everyone wants to push it and having more options helps everyone else!

To kind of put these in order from lowest power to most here is the break down

Stock
93 octane
E85 stock fuel system
E50 stock fuel system
E50 upgraded fuel system
E85 upgraded fuel system

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Great info sir ... could you put in perspective the HP gains roughly on the following fuel options you stated.


Stock
93 octane
E85 stock fuel system
E50 stock fuel system
E50 upgraded fuel system
E85 upgraded fuel system


2020 Explorer ST - Storm Trooper Build

Borla S-Type Exhaust | SPD Downpipes | Vossen HF-5 | Michelin PSS Tires | Speeda Rear Sway | Turbosmart BOV | Rear Wiper Delete | Clear Bra | Tinted Headlights | H&R Springs | Custom Carbon Fiber Steering Wheel | Custom Front and Rear Emblems

 

[LokiWolf]

This is my ST that the development was done on. The tune is strong. I will eventually get a 1/4 mile time. So everybody can compare that to the 93 tunes.

It does not fade. It pulls strong all the way.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[LokiWolf]

Great info sir ... could you put in perspective the HP gains roughly on the following fuel options you stated.


Stock
93 octane
E85 stock fuel system
E50 stock fuel system
E50 upgraded fuel system
E85 upgraded fuel system


2020 Explorer ST - Storm Trooper Build

Borla S-Type Exhaust | SPD Downpipes | Vossen HF-5 | Michelin PSS Tires | Speeda Rear Sway | Turbosmart BOV | Rear Wiper Delete | Clear Bra | Tinted Headlights | H&R Springs | Custom Carbon Fiber Steering Wheel | Custom Front and Rear Emblems

I can’t give you HP numbers as mine hasn’t been on a Dyno, and they are partially useless. All Dynos are different, I can give you 0-60 for 4 of these on the same vehicle.

Stock(93) - 5.4
ZFG 93 Race - 4.06
ZFG E85 - 4.01
ZFG E50 - 3.75

The E85’s run was done in 12 degree warmer ambient air, 73 vs 61.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Nbk4t5e]

I can’t give you HP numbers as mine hasn’t been on a Dyno, and they are partially useless. All Dynos are different, I can give you 0-60 for 4 of these on the same vehicle.

Stock(93) - 5.4
ZFG 93 Race - 4.06
ZFG E85 - 4.01
ZFG E50 - 3.75

The E85’s run was done in 12 degree warmer ambient air, 73 vs 61.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Thanks ! 4 sec on the 93 is great, honestly .


This is San Antonio right now

 

[LokiWolf]

Thanks ! 4 sec on the 93 is great, honestly .


This is San Antonio right now

Then if E85 is available you will see more benefit from it. It will help fight the loss from heat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Nbk4t5e]

Then if E85 is available you will see more benefit from it. It will help fight the loss from heat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Yes but only 3 gas stations in all of San Antonio. I’m waiting like I said until the Intercooler.


2020 Explorer ST - Storm Trooper Build

Borla S-Type Exhaust | SPD Downpipes | Vossen HF-5 | Michelin PSS Tires | Speeda Rear Sway | Turbosmart BOV | Rear Wiper Delete | Clear Bra | Tinted Headlights | H&R Springs | Custom Carbon Fiber Steering Wheel | Custom Front and Rear Emblems

 

[Jshaffer3819]

Alright guys Explorer ST, I get asked this a lot. “I want to run ethanol, but I do not want to mix fuels and I’m not sure I want to buy the Xreme DI pump yet, is that my only options?” I typically try to get people into either e50 or buying the HPFP because that is what it takes if you want to push the ST to the limit of the turbos. However, there is a 3rd option and that is e85 on the stock fuel system. I have been doing this with some people in the f150 as we developed the flex fuel tune (yes flex fuel can work, I’m getting ready to release that in the f150 market next month). You may be thinking how is the a possible? The pump isn’t big enough? You have told us this since day one. Well you are right the pump isn’t big enough to push the truck, but if you want to run e85 on the stock fuel system it can be done at lower boost level. That’s what we have done with Ray’s to test it out. Running slightly more than stock boost takes use to roughly 95% capacity of the stock fuel system and we were able to run a 4.01 0-60. That is better than most 93 tunes and Also, because we are not leaning on the turbos very hard, there is less heat build up which is going to result in better ¼ mile times the 93, especially in the heat.

I think this going to be a great option if you are someone who wants to try e85 but does not want to blend fuels but still wants to try e85 before investing the HPFP and injectors. I understand it is a lot of money to invest to run e85 to its full potential and I’m hoping that this and the e50 option will help people realize the power potential of ethanol fuels.

This is also a great option for someone who want a very conservative, very consistent tune that does not fade away as fast a 93-octane tune on the big end.

Ultimately if you want to push your ST you need to upgrade the fuel system, there is just no way around that, but I also understand that not everyone wants to push it and having more options helps everyone else!

To kind of put these in order from lowest power to most here is the break down

Stock
93 octane
E85 stock fuel system
E50 stock fuel system
E50 upgraded fuel system
E85 upgraded fuel system

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Great info, thank you. Which combination is better for the engine in the long run? I like the speed and at all but want this vehicle to last a while too. I rarely buy new until this Explorer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ashpian52]

Is this an E85 Flex Fuel tune or is that one still in development?

The added HP over stock for each of those levels would also be interesting to see.

Nice work!

 

[ZFGracing]

Is this an E85 Flex Fuel tune or is that one still in development?

The added HP over stock for each of those levels would also be interesting to see.

Nice work!

I haven't tried flex fuel yet on these but I will be soon

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

 

[ExploST]

so I know in the Fiesta community there are discussions of the wear and tear of running full E85. Do we have enough data to determine what the long term effects could be, or are on say injectors? Just curious as I am new to the platform and have easy access to E85 next to work. So the appeal is great. I have mixed before and I'm not afraid too. Just not ready to start playing with fuel upgrades on another platform just yet. Along the topic of ethanol blends though. I'm curious if we have a decent ethanol content gauge available. Formerly I used an Innovate Motorsports Gauge. TIA

 

[twin001]

ohhhh damn, just found E85 down the street from me! I am waiting for my Thermal exhaust to show up and then I'll send my stock log to ZFG for my baseline. I do have the LMS E30 tune available, might test a tank of E30 out. I ordered a test kit on Amazon, be here on Sunday.

 

[TMac]

I haven't tried flex fuel yet on these but I will be soon

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

I'm very curious as to how you would truly achieve what you're posting. From what I have researched (correct me if I'm wrong), there are no ethanol fuel content sensors aboard the ST. It would also mean that the factory ECU would have to provide overlay maps for interpolation of the content to adjust on the fly (or at least at every fill up) for the E85. So, that being the case, how would you achieve this? Are there mapping capabilities carried over from flex fuel capable vehicles that you'd be using? How would you "plumb" the ethanol content sensor into the stock ecu and interpret it? Without fuel interpolation mapping capability and an ethanol content sensor, I don't see how you would achieve "true" flex fueling

 

[MikeWolfe]

You don't need a fuel sensor
These vehicles have LINEAR OXYGEN SENSORS which merely change fuel trim to match the fuel mix & maintain stoichiometry

 

[MikeWolfe]

so I know in the Fiesta community there are discussions of the wear and tear of running full E85. Do we have enough data to determine what the long term effects could be, or are on say injectors? Just curious as I am new to the platform and have easy access to E85 next to work. So the appeal is great. I have mixed before and I'm not afraid too. Just not ready to start playing with fuel upgrades on another platform just yet. Along the topic of ethanol blends though. I'm curious if we have a decent ethanol content gauge available. Formerly I used an Innovate Motorsports Gauge. TIA

Any vehicles designed to run on E10 or E15 have ethanol compatible components
Does not make any difference whether it is e10 or e85 the same components must be used
Injector flow rates & the high pressure fuel pump must have adequate flow rates to support the higher flow rates required for ethanol operation

 

[TMac]

You don't need a fuel sensor
These vehicles have LINEAR OXYGEN SENSORS which merely change fuel trim to match the fuel mix & maintain stoichiometry

We're not talking about merely closed loop stoichiometric fuel adjustments. The conversation is about dealing with timing, boost, and fuel enrichment when you're using fuels with varying amounts of ethanol/gasoline mixture to enhance performance, not merely to detect stoich.

In general, to do that, you need maps and an algorithm that interpolate between known injection pulse width values which to my knowlege require some type of ethanol content sensing. This also affects timing and boost values. When you're going WOT, you're not running at stoich. No doubt the O2 sensors can tell the ECU a closed-loop cruising fuel trim, but that's different than a WOT pull.

If you have knowledge that the ST ECU uses the 02 sensor input and the closed loop short-term fuel trim numbers to estimate ethanol percentage (which is theoretically possible), I'd like to know more about it.

 

[TMac]

Jesus christ people still think e85 ruins everything? What is this, 2007 still?

Just run pump OP ethanol is going to *insert something about seals/rings/pumps/hoses here* and also it's only for hippies and vagrants and liberals be a man and buy a mustang.

WTF? What beverage were you consuming when you added this informative post?

 

[V8bait]

WTF? What beverage were you consuming when you added this informative post?

Ethanol. Dude deleted his post so I will too. Some people are still afraid of e85.

 

[Jonx96]

I’d be on board with the flex fuel tune on stock fuel system. We have plenty of e85 around here. Day to day driving it would be great long road trips I would have to use a different fuel.
I’ve not seen but 2 mpg decrease on my hellcat when driving normal. Full throttle it drains the fuel much faster but o well.
I can get 21mpg pretty easy on the highway. Sometimes 22 on my full e85 tune.
I will say I have spent a lot of time dialing that tune in. But I’m sure you will have these down pretty good.
I don’t know much about Ford tuning to want to try it myself.

 

[MikeWolfe]

We're not talking about merely closed loop stoichiometric fuel adjustments. The conversation is about dealing with timing, boost, and fuel enrichment when you're using fuels with varying amounts of ethanol/gasoline mixture to enhance performance, not merely to detect stoich.

In general, to do that, you need maps and an algorithm that interpolate between known injection pulse width values which to my knowlege require some type of ethanol content sensing. This also affects timing and boost values. When you're going WOT, you're not running at stoich. No doubt the O2 sensors can tell the ECU a closed-loop cruising fuel trim, but that's different than a WOT pull.

If you have knowledge that the ST ECU uses the 02 sensor input and the closed loop short-term fuel trim numbers to estimate ethanol percentage (which is theoretically possible), I'd like to know more about it.

Most modern vehicles use LINEAR or A/F sensors
Regardless of the fuel mix the LINEAR SENSOR input will adjust fuel to maintain stoichiometry
When using ethanol blends fuel trim PLUS PERCENTAGES will increase as the amount of ethanol increases
Their is no inline ethanol sensor on many FLEX FUEL vehicles with GDI & PFI
In some cases the same injectors & other components are the same for FLEX FUEL & NON FLEX FUEL VEHICLES
The only difference is the software (PROGRAMMING)
They just use linear sensors to maintain stoichiometry